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Interview with Alexander Vedernikov, Artistic Director of the Bolshoi Theatre.
The situation in the economy today directly affects the functioning of art. According to Alexander Vedernikov, artistic director of the Gabt, now, in the midst of the financial crisis, it's time to start transformations in Russian musical theaters. ALEXANDER VEDERNIKOV told RBC daily correspondent Maya KRYLOVA about how he sees the complex of anti-crisis measures.
— Alexander Alexandrovich, what changes in the Russian opera and in the Bolshoi Opera should we start today?
— The human psyche is so arranged that when everything is well, no one wants structural and functional changes. And during a crisis, people are forced to make such changes. So now it's time to make the transformation. Today, in my opinion, the main problem of musical theaters in Russia is that they exist separately from each other, as non-communicating vessels. It is clear that the problems of the Samara Theater and the Bolshoi Theater are in many ways different, and that the possibilities of the central theaters as a whole are much greater. But it is possible and necessary to connect the musical groups of the country due to the commonality of organizational processes. We need all kinds of cooperation, which is especially important during a crisis. This will save money and improve the quality of performances, which is important primarily for the audience. The Bolshoi and Mariinsky Theaters live especially apart from other theaters in the country. Of course, our tours in Russia have intensified recently, but this is not enough. We must focus on staged co-production with the collectives of the country — if, of course, the size of the stage of provincial theaters allows. This is correct both politically, economically, and from an educational point of view.
— What prevents the introduction of such a system?
— The state should take a strategic look at its theatrical policy. In some matters, our theaters still live according to the resolutions of the Council of People's Commissars of the 30s of the last century. For cooperation, it is necessary to change Russian legislation. For example, for creative people, it is necessary to introduce the status of a free professional. This will enable the best personnel of the country to work throughout Russia. Today, the Bolshoi Theatre cannot use the talented human resources that exist in the country, and the province is not able to invite the best voices and directing staff from the capitals.
In addition, there is no market for opera singers in Russia, which contradicts world practice. All over the world, the singer, offering his voice to theaters, does so through an agent. The singer's job is to sing, the conductor's job is to conduct, and the agent's job is to tell theaters and philharmonic halls what a talented client he has. This is only in Russian show business, because there is an active market there. In the field of academic music, we do not have a market. And there are almost no professional agents. The artists are also not ready for this psychologically, they do not want to pay agents money. And the system of philharmonic halls with theaters, which has historically developed in our country, does not at all imply a free exchange of artists. Singers and musicians are on staff and on salary and have to keep a work record somewhere, while everywhere in the world our workshop workers work freely under contracts.
— Judging by your answers, you are a supporter of the active participation of the state in the life of theaters.
— Yes, the country needs structural transformations in the field of culture. For example, you need to figure out the number of opera houses. Our theater, once opened, exists indefinitely, by the very fact of its opening. But it would be nice to understand why? For example, how can there be good voices in the local musical theater if there is no conservatory in the city? I recently attended an interesting event — the All-Russian Meeting of Trumpeters. And there's a young musician asking me: "In our region, performances at the opera house are at an extremely low artistic level. Should I advise people to go to the opera, to the classics, or should I warn them?" I replied that it was better to warn. Otherwise, people's taste in music will deteriorate and they will lose the desire to go to the opera at all.
Maybe in some cases, instead of several archaic and poor opera houses, it is worth making one — rich, creatively staffed, actively touring, capable of spiritually "nurturing" the audience of a large region at a decent level? Another problem that the director of the Bolshoi Theatre Anatoly Iksanov is actively talking about. Joint founding of theaters is prohibited in Russia. But that's not wise! If the law were different, theaters could be financed simultaneously at several levels — federal, regional, city, private… Which, again, is relevant in times of financial turmoil.
— Let's go back to Gabt. Won't the Bolshoi Theater have to change the poster, adapting it to the tastes of the conservative mass audience, so that people in crisis "vote in rubles" and buy opera tickets?
— Yes, the audience loves realistic directing very much. The most advanced viewers do not come to our opera performances much. I think an opera house, especially a Large One, should focus on a cultural audience, but the problem is that such an audience is more likely to go to the conservatory or to the drama. The roots of this phenomenon are in the recent artistic history of the GABTA opera: in the 80s and 90s, it went through a rather depressive period, and I repeatedly communicated with educated people, whom life simply weaned from coming to us. You will say that this is a minority. But within the framework of a city of fourteen million, a minority would be enough for us.
Throughout its history, Bolshoi generally had few opportunities to be just a musical theater. He became a national symbol, a court theater, a keeper of traditions, a museum, a cultural sign... and history often denied him the privilege of being a theater. This state of affairs has also affected the distribution of responsibilities within the management of the theater. Our decision-making priorities are mostly administrative, not creative. Thus, the Big One is largely deprived of the opportunity to be a "mirror" of the processes that take place in society. To be truly modern. Now this problem is especially relevant — I hope that the reconstruction of the Bolshoi will end sooner or later, but now everyone is so busy with the protracted construction that no one thinks about how the theater will enter these walls. I am doing everything possible to make the "musical heart" of the theater beat in a new way, but, I admit, there are not always enough administrative levers for this.
— Do you want to educate the public, raise its level?
— Yes. To do this, among other measures, it is necessary to change the performance rental system. We have taught the public that they should go to the same titles until they are blue in the face. The audience has no time or mental strength left for new products. The Russian public does not understand that every performance has a stage life, finite in time. That's what they say with reproach: "Director Chernyakov made this strange version of Onegin, and what, will the play continue to run on the stage of the Bolshoi Theater now?" The crisis should also prompt a change in the rental system. I am sure that we will have to switch from a repertory to a "block" show to one degree or another, as is customary in most musical theaters in the world. This will allow you to better rehearse the performances and raise the quality of the performances. It is only important that the repertoire in the Moscow opera houses is not similar. So that three "Traviata" and four "Carmen" are not shown in the city at the same time. Here again, the cooperation of theaters is needed, already at the stage of thinking about new productions and reconciling plans. If the crisis drags on and the issue of filling the auditorium escalates, we will definitely come to this.
Of course, these are all difficult decisions. GABT has historically been an extremely inertial system, moreover, excessive in terms of the number of people working in it. And I would also reduce the number of titles in the poster. I understand that I am expressing an unpopular point of view. But in a situation where there are several opera houses in Moscow and they are all hunting for the audience, I would reduce the number of titles, but at the same time put a sharp emphasis on quality. And I would recommend such a recipe not only to a Large One, but to any large and famous theater in the country.
— But practice shows that in our country, unlike in the West, tickets begin to sell poorly if the theater rolls one name for a long time.
— This is a marketing issue. It's a matter of knowing exactly who your audience is. For example, the subscription system develops the viewer's habit of systematically visiting the theater. Or the concept of "target audience groups" — children, for example, or rural residents. There is a La Scala program for workers at the La Scala Theater in Milan." This does not mean that the proletariat is being "sold" an opera of the second grade. This is a special program for the promotion of opera art to the masses, certain ways of distributing tickets and a certain pricing policy. And our theaters in the capitals do not work with the audience much. The cashiers are just sitting at the ticket offices and waiting for people to come to them to buy tickets. We need to do it differently. Each opera performance has its own, if I may say so, audience capacity. The play to Tchaikovsky's music has one, Stravinsky has another. Under Soviet rule, operas were rolled for decades. It's impossible now. If Stravinsky's "difficult" to perceive is played in blocks, then the problem of hall occupancy at productions of his operas will be eliminated. The theater will plan this in advance: for example, "The Adventures of a Rake" will be held seven times — and that's it. And to carry out a powerful PR campaign for this show.
— It is known that after the noise caused by the screenings of the operas "Rosenthal's Children" and "Eugene Onegin", some viewers wrote letters to state authorities up to the president, in which they poured out indignation: they say that the GABT is losing classical traditions, the theater is dying. How would you respond to such viewers?
— I regularly receive similar messages myself. It seems to me that one of the privileges of the Bolshoi is that everything should be in this theater. Both museum and academic productions and modern ones. But purely psychologically… If the audience was at the performance and liked the performance, it is unlikely that this person will run to the desk and write a message of gratitude to the director or the music director: what good fellows you guys are, how wonderful everything is with you. No, the viewer will grab the pen in the event that the production, as they say, did not fall on his soul. And the question is brewing: why would such a viewer not exercise his right to choose? If you don't like Rosenthal's Children, go to The Tsar's Bride in our theater. And if our "Eugene Onegin" is not suitable, this is a great reason to visit other versions of the opera in other theaters of the city and country.
Alexander Vedernikov worked at the Moscow Academic Musical Theater. Stanislavsky and Nemirovich-Danchenko, was the artistic director and chief conductor of the symphony orchestra "Russian Philharmonic" founded by him. In 2001, he was appointed Chief Conductor and Music Director of the Bolshoi Theatre. Under his leadership, the operas "Adrienne Lecouvreur", "The Fiery Angel", "The Flying Dutchman" were staged. In 2008, he released the premiere of the opera "The Tale of the Invisible City of Kitezh and the Virgin Fevronia".
Interview with Alexander Vedernikov, Artistic Director of the Bolshoi Theatre.
The situation in the economy today directly affects the functioning of art. According to Alexander Vedernikov, artistic director of the Gabt, now, in the midst of the financial crisis, it's time to start transformations in Russian musical theaters. ALEXANDER VEDERNIKOV told RBC daily correspondent Maya KRYLOVA about how he sees the complex of anti-crisis measures.
— Alexander Alexandrovich, what changes in the Russian opera and in the Bolshoi Opera should we start today?
— The human psyche is so arranged that when everything is well, no one wants structural and functional changes. And during a crisis, people are forced to make such changes. So now it's time to make the transformation. Today, in my opinion, the main problem of musical theaters in Russia is that they exist separately from each other, as non-communicating vessels. It is clear that the problems of the Samara Theater and the Bolshoi Theater are in many ways different, and that the possibilities of the central theaters as a whole are much greater. But it is possible and necessary to connect the musical groups of the country due to the commonality of organizational processes. We need all kinds of cooperation, which is especially important during a crisis. This will save money and improve the quality of performances, which is important primarily for the audience. The Bolshoi and Mariinsky Theaters live especially apart from other theaters in the country. Of course, our tours in Russia have intensified recently, but this is not enough. We must focus on staged co-production with the collectives of the country — if, of course, the size of the stage of provincial theaters allows. This is correct both politically, economically, and from an educational point of view.
— What prevents the introduction of such a system?
— The state should take a strategic look at its theatrical policy. In some matters, our theaters still live according to the resolutions of the Council of People's Commissars of the 30s of the last century. For cooperation, it is necessary to change Russian legislation. For example, for creative people, it is necessary to introduce the status of a free professional. This will enable the best personnel of the country to work throughout Russia. Today, the Bolshoi Theatre cannot use the talented human resources that exist in the country, and the province is not able to invite the best voices and directing staff from the capitals.
In addition, there is no market for opera singers in Russia, which contradicts world practice. All over the world, the singer, offering his voice to theaters, does so through an agent. The singer's job is to sing, the conductor's job is to conduct, and the agent's job is to tell theaters and philharmonic halls what a talented client he has. This is only in Russian show business, because there is an active market there. In the field of academic music, we do not have a market. And there are almost no professional agents. The artists are also not ready for this psychologically, they do not want to pay agents money. And the system of philharmonic halls with theaters, which has historically developed in our country, does not at all imply a free exchange of artists. Singers and musicians are on staff and on salary and have to keep a work record somewhere, while everywhere in the world our workshop workers work freely under contracts.
— Judging by your answers, you are a supporter of the active participation of the state in the life of theaters.
— Yes, the country needs structural transformations in the field of culture. For example, you need to figure out the number of opera houses. Our theater, once opened, exists indefinitely, by the very fact of its opening. But it would be nice to understand why? For example, how can there be good voices in the local musical theater if there is no conservatory in the city? I recently attended an interesting event — the All-Russian Meeting of Trumpeters. And there's a young musician asking me: "In our region, performances at the opera house are at an extremely low artistic level. Should I advise people to go to the opera, to the classics, or should I warn them?" I replied that it was better to warn. Otherwise, people's taste in music will deteriorate and they will lose the desire to go to the opera at all.
Maybe in some cases, instead of several archaic and poor opera houses, it is worth making one — rich, creatively staffed, actively touring, capable of spiritually "nurturing" the audience of a large region at a decent level? Another problem that the director of the Bolshoi Theatre Anatoly Iksanov is actively talking about. Joint founding of theaters is prohibited in Russia. But that's not wise! If the law were different, theaters could be financed simultaneously at several levels — federal, regional, city, private… Which, again, is relevant in times of financial turmoil.
— Let's go back to Gabt. Won't the Bolshoi Theater have to change the poster, adapting it to the tastes of the conservative mass audience, so that people in crisis "vote in rubles" and buy opera tickets?
— Yes, the audience loves realistic directing very much. The most advanced viewers do not come to our opera performances much. I think an opera house, especially a Large One, should focus on a cultural audience, but the problem is that such an audience is more likely to go to the conservatory or to the drama. The roots of this phenomenon are in the recent artistic history of the GABTA opera: in the 80s and 90s, it went through a rather depressive period, and I repeatedly communicated with educated people, whom life simply weaned from coming to us. You will say that this is a minority. But within the framework of a city of fourteen million, a minority would be enough for us.
Throughout its history, Bolshoi generally had few opportunities to be just a musical theater. He became a national symbol, a court theater, a keeper of traditions, a museum, a cultural sign... and history often denied him the privilege of being a theater. This state of affairs has also affected the distribution of responsibilities within the management of the theater. Our decision-making priorities are mostly administrative, not creative. Thus, the Big One is largely deprived of the opportunity to be a "mirror" of the processes that take place in society. To be truly modern. Now this problem is especially relevant — I hope that the reconstruction of the Bolshoi will end sooner or later, but now everyone is so busy with the protracted construction that no one thinks about how the theater will enter these walls. I am doing everything possible to make the "musical heart" of the theater beat in a new way, but, I admit, there are not always enough administrative levers for this.
— Do you want to educate the public, raise its level?
— Yes. To do this, among other measures, it is necessary to change the performance rental system. We have taught the public that they should go to the same titles until they are blue in the face. The audience has no time or mental strength left for new products. The Russian public does not understand that every performance has a stage life, finite in time. That's what they say with reproach: "Director Chernyakov made this strange version of Onegin, and what, will the play continue to run on the stage of the Bolshoi Theater now?" The crisis should also prompt a change in the rental system. I am sure that we will have to switch from a repertory to a "block" show to one degree or another, as is customary in most musical theaters in the world. This will allow you to better rehearse the performances and raise the quality of the performances. It is only important that the repertoire in the Moscow opera houses is not similar. So that three "Traviata" and four "Carmen" are not shown in the city at the same time. Here again, the cooperation of theaters is needed, already at the stage of thinking about new productions and reconciling plans. If the crisis drags on and the issue of filling the auditorium escalates, we will definitely come to this.
Of course, these are all difficult decisions. GABT has historically been an extremely inertial system, moreover, excessive in terms of the number of people working in it. And I would also reduce the number of titles in the poster. I understand that I am expressing an unpopular point of view. But in a situation where there are several opera houses in Moscow and they are all hunting for the audience, I would reduce the number of titles, but at the same time put a sharp emphasis on quality. And I would recommend such a recipe not only to a Large One, but to any large and famous theater in the country.
— But practice shows that in our country, unlike in the West, tickets begin to sell poorly if the theater rolls one name for a long time.
— This is a marketing issue. It's a matter of knowing exactly who your audience is. For example, the subscription system develops the viewer's habit of systematically visiting the theater. Or the concept of "target audience groups" — children, for example, or rural residents. There is a La Scala program for workers at the La Scala Theater in Milan." This does not mean that the proletariat is being "sold" an opera of the second grade. This is a special program for the promotion of opera art to the masses, certain ways of distributing tickets and a certain pricing policy. And our theaters in the capitals do not work with the audience much. The cashiers are just sitting at the ticket offices and waiting for people to come to them to buy tickets. We need to do it differently. Each opera performance has its own, if I may say so, audience capacity. The play to Tchaikovsky's music has one, Stravinsky has another. Under Soviet rule, operas were rolled for decades. It's impossible now. If Stravinsky's "difficult" to perceive is played in blocks, then the problem of hall occupancy at productions of his operas will be eliminated. The theater will plan this in advance: for example, "The Adventures of a Rake" will be held seven times — and that's it. And to carry out a powerful PR campaign for this show.
— It is known that after the noise caused by the screenings of the operas "Rosenthal's Children" and "Eugene Onegin", some viewers wrote letters to state authorities up to the president, in which they poured out indignation: they say that the GABT is losing classical traditions, the theater is dying. How would you respond to such viewers?
— I regularly receive similar messages myself. It seems to me that one of the privileges of the Bolshoi is that everything should be in this theater. Both museum and academic productions and modern ones. But purely psychologically… If the audience was at the performance and liked the performance, it is unlikely that this person will run to the desk and write a message of gratitude to the director or the music director: what good fellows you guys are, how wonderful everything is with you. No, the viewer will grab the pen in the event that the production, as they say, did not fall on his soul. And the question is brewing: why would such a viewer not exercise his right to choose? If you don't like Rosenthal's Children, go to The Tsar's Bride in our theater. And if our "Eugene Onegin" is not suitable, this is a great reason to visit other versions of the opera in other theaters of the city and country.
Alexander Vedernikov worked at the Moscow Academic Musical Theater. Stanislavsky and Nemirovich-Danchenko, was the artistic director and chief conductor of the symphony orchestra "Russian Philharmonic" founded by him. In 2001, he was appointed Chief Conductor and Music Director of the Bolshoi Theatre. Under his leadership, the operas "Adrienne Lecouvreur", "The Fiery Angel", "The Flying Dutchman" were staged. In 2008, he released the premiere of the opera "The Tale of the Invisible City of Kitezh and the Virgin Fevronia".
Maya KRYLOVA,
RBK dayli, Ferbruary, 5, 2009
RBK dayli, Ferbruary, 5, 2009
"The state should take a strategic look at theatrical strategy"
