<The title of the article and the text are translated into English automatically, and will be edited in the future>
Before the appointment of a new artistic director to the State Register named after Svetlanova has only a few days left. Of course, many people would like to see Valery Gergiev in this post (recall that it was he who suspended Gorenstein from the Tchaikovsky competition 2011 after an unsuccessful statement addressed to the Armenian cellist).
But Gergiev already has an entire empire in his hands, all the managerial threads. How can you be emperor twice?
Yesterday, in a cafe on Bronnaya Street, we talked with another contender — the chief conductor of the Symphony Orchestra in Odense, Denmark, Alexander Vedernikov.
Weighing all the pros and cons, the former conductor of the Bolshoi Theater could turn out to be the most reasonable candidate of all those called. In an exclusive interview with MK, he told what, in his opinion, the new State Register should be.
— How should GASO differ from the others? Still, nominally, he is the main one…
— In the years of my youth, it was not necessary to come up with how one orchestra should differ from another — everything was already in sound. As a student, I had an argument with a friend: here they broadcast music on the radio — take it and guess who is playing.
I easily distinguished the State Orchestra of P. Svetlanov ("fleshy" sound and even with vibrato, convex timbre display), and Fedoseevsky (soft rounded, "Russian" sound of strings), and the orchestra of the Moscow Philharmonic of the Kondrashin era/Kitaenko. Therefore, it was interesting to compare how one or another group plays, say, Tchaikovsky's symphony.
— Why is it lost today?
— We have what we have: a crisis of motivation. Nobody needs anything. Neither above nor below. No, there are honest musicians, there are also music lovers, but the sense of perspective that "tomorrow should be better than today" has left us. Primitive box office logic prevails: why play symphonies by Bruckner or Sibelius when Tchaikovsky's Fifth is selling well?
So you and I will slide down to a Little Mozart night serenade, performed without an orchestra by an electronic fart. Everything is commercially simplified. But the principle of "making more money" on classics should not become a priority. And I look suspiciously at the huge posters hung around the city, saying that such and such an opera star is coming — wonderful, but this has nothing to do with art.
The laws of show business are being introduced into our workshop: the one who is more famous becomes the best. But this is not so: being the best is one motivation, being famous is quite another.
— So let's go back to GASO: how can he become the best?
— First of all, we need to offer the public a whole palette of major performers - conductors and soloists, who should express all the best that exists on the national and world stage.
— What, and the conductors? So you need to share, and not just row everything for yourself?
— Of course. Otherwise, some of our orchestras have long existed in the form of private shops.
After all, what is the tragedy — Gorenstein was removed and there seems to be no orchestra. Everything instantly crumbled. And take away Sir Simon Rattle – the Berlin Philharmonic will remain anyway.
Musicians want a lot of rights, but they are not ready to take responsibility for anything. By the way, the famous Persimfans (a collective of the 20s of the XX century, who performed without a conductor) after the collapse took part in the formation of the State Orchestra.
That's how GASO would have gathered and played his anniversary concert without a conductor — it's a big deal! But it would be an act, a bright page in history, they would say, "our value is sovereign, we sit down and play," but... it's weak for them.
— Can I clarify: do I need to regularly invite figures like Zubin Mehta or Kurt Mazur to the console?
— The most famous does not mean the best. But in general you are right. Another thing is that the orchestra itself must be ready for such maestros.
— Is it necessary for European musicians to sit in our orchestras?
— Alas, our legislation does not allow it. Although for some reason it allows you to buy football players from Cameroon and give them Russian passports (this is the question of state priorities). But to announce a competition for the position of concertmaster, to call a musician – okay from Europe, from Ukraine! — It's impossible.
We tried to announce an international competition for the first harp in the Bolshoi Theater Orchestra, well, there were no worthy first harps in Russia. They immediately started calling us from the human resources department and telling us not to do this: "we don't want to spend days in the migration service!".
It seems that there is no "iron curtain", but it remains in the laws and in the minds of officials. But it's very useful to invite Western musicians — you have to feel the competition somehow!
— Maybe even appoint a foreigner to GASO?
— Again, when everything is fine in the orchestra, why not? Otherwise, he just won't understand which coordinate system he got into. How can I explain to him that I have to pay almost 1 million rubles to play in the Great Hall of the Conservatory?
— And if we aim to build a new hall for GASO?
— I will get an answer to this: "You know, Alexander Alexandrovich, historically GASO has never had its own hall. Well, why should it arise now?" That's all.
Another aspect is that the State Register must be recorded, leaving a trace behind. Let's say a cycle of Tchaikovsky's symphonies, a kind of new reading of Russian classics.
What else is good to do: build relationships with universities so that there is an influx of the right staff. Initiate the study of such specific instruments as the piccolo flute, the English horn, otherwise the musicians themselves begin to retrain…
I would also love to choose some orchestra on the periphery as a partner. I would take creative patronage over him, develop him. After all, it is wrong that everything closes only on Moscow. The musicians would go to master classes, play something together, we need to give an impulse!
Otherwise, there is nothing there — there was one cello in the Syktyvkar theater – musicians do not go to the hinterland, and if they go, the maximum is for an apartment, but where can I get so many of them?…
— How to build relationships with living composers?
— In Western orchestras, you have to play a certain number of modern music, and it doesn't matter whether people go to concerts or not. As long as the Union of Composers is alive, it is necessary to involve it in these processes.
Why don't many people play new music here? Because you have to buy a hall for a lot of money (the same BZK – 900,000 rubles per evening), and you will no longer be up to modern music – you are being pushed all the time to Rachmaninov's Second Concert. Simplification of practice.
— And as for the term of government of the State Register – for how many years is it optimal to invite the artistic director?
— The rule should be some kind of reasonable rotation. The period that was at the controls, for example, Evgeny Fedorovich Svetlanov, is considerable. Well, it was in a completely different country. Now all creative cycles have been shortened.
This is how I see it: one conductor can give the orchestra one thing, another another, and the orchestra grows on these conductors. And if the conductor overstays, all development stops.
— Is it necessary to cultivate second conductors, assistants from the youth?
— Who is the conductor? This is a man who knows: No matter what happens, I'm not going to be lost anyway. And that's right. The conductor must be independent. And if it is "nurtured", it turns out to be complete nonsense. You have to find your own way to get into this market, gain a foothold in it.
— So you reject the institution of second conductors?
— If you conduct everything all year round by yourself, of course, you need a second conductor. And if you have all the work, sorry, done, if Kurt Mazur stands at your desk tomorrow, and Seiji Ozawa the day after tomorrow, then you don't need a second conductor, but an assistant. That's the difference.
— Can the head of the State Registry have a job on the side?
— I have to. If the artistic director of GASO plays only in GASO, then this is the wrong chief conductor. And in this situation, I wonder how the Ministry of Culture will behave, because they want a decent artistic director, and where to get someone who is not burdened with plans for the next 3 years?
— What kind of employment do you have in Odense?
— 6 weeks a year. You understand that the main one should not get up at the console every day — it is important to organize the process so that the musicians themselves raise the level of the orchestra. This is ideal. The process of making the orchestra look divine takes 3–3.5 years.
When I came to the Bolshoi Theater, I fought–fought with the orchestra with all my might — and no result. But suddenly, at some point, there was a qualitative leap. Of course, you can sit down, thoroughly learn a specific program and play it well. But it's wrong to do that. It is necessary that the orchestra — regardless of who stands in front of them — show the level. It must be in the blood, at the level of habit.
— Can you teach this?
— Sometimes it is possible, and sometimes it is necessary to dismiss. It is wrong when the main one yells: "but you have something fake!", these issues should be resolved within the team, at the level of instrument groups. The better the orchestra, the more technical issues are NOT solved at the level of the chief conductor. And the artistic director deals exclusively with artistic tasks.
The questions — "higher tone — lower", "playing together — not together" — should go to the level of the concertmasters of the groups. That's how they should be organized. This is a correction of the head device.
A person should understand that you can not wear red socks to a dress pair.
So in the orchestra, the musicians THEMSELVES should not pass by the rehearsal falsehood. Then it will be interesting for major Western maestros with such an orchestra — they will communicate on equal terms, and not that the musicians will sit intimidated, hammered to the brim with endless drill…
— You said 3.5 years... that is, you can't take the main one for a shorter period?
— You can take three when everything is in order. When the machine is running. She drives by herself, without the fashionable "manual control". And not like we constantly have to find an "anti-crisis manager".
Source.
Before the appointment of a new artistic director to the State Register named after Svetlanova has only a few days left. Of course, many people would like to see Valery Gergiev in this post (recall that it was he who suspended Gorenstein from the Tchaikovsky competition 2011 after an unsuccessful statement addressed to the Armenian cellist).
But Gergiev already has an entire empire in his hands, all the managerial threads. How can you be emperor twice?
Yesterday, in a cafe on Bronnaya Street, we talked with another contender — the chief conductor of the Symphony Orchestra in Odense, Denmark, Alexander Vedernikov.
Weighing all the pros and cons, the former conductor of the Bolshoi Theater could turn out to be the most reasonable candidate of all those called. In an exclusive interview with MK, he told what, in his opinion, the new State Register should be.
— How should GASO differ from the others? Still, nominally, he is the main one…
— In the years of my youth, it was not necessary to come up with how one orchestra should differ from another — everything was already in sound. As a student, I had an argument with a friend: here they broadcast music on the radio — take it and guess who is playing.
I easily distinguished the State Orchestra of P. Svetlanov ("fleshy" sound and even with vibrato, convex timbre display), and Fedoseevsky (soft rounded, "Russian" sound of strings), and the orchestra of the Moscow Philharmonic of the Kondrashin era/Kitaenko. Therefore, it was interesting to compare how one or another group plays, say, Tchaikovsky's symphony.
— Why is it lost today?
— We have what we have: a crisis of motivation. Nobody needs anything. Neither above nor below. No, there are honest musicians, there are also music lovers, but the sense of perspective that "tomorrow should be better than today" has left us. Primitive box office logic prevails: why play symphonies by Bruckner or Sibelius when Tchaikovsky's Fifth is selling well?
So you and I will slide down to a Little Mozart night serenade, performed without an orchestra by an electronic fart. Everything is commercially simplified. But the principle of "making more money" on classics should not become a priority. And I look suspiciously at the huge posters hung around the city, saying that such and such an opera star is coming — wonderful, but this has nothing to do with art.
The laws of show business are being introduced into our workshop: the one who is more famous becomes the best. But this is not so: being the best is one motivation, being famous is quite another.
— So let's go back to GASO: how can he become the best?
— First of all, we need to offer the public a whole palette of major performers - conductors and soloists, who should express all the best that exists on the national and world stage.
— What, and the conductors? So you need to share, and not just row everything for yourself?
— Of course. Otherwise, some of our orchestras have long existed in the form of private shops.
After all, what is the tragedy — Gorenstein was removed and there seems to be no orchestra. Everything instantly crumbled. And take away Sir Simon Rattle – the Berlin Philharmonic will remain anyway.
Musicians want a lot of rights, but they are not ready to take responsibility for anything. By the way, the famous Persimfans (a collective of the 20s of the XX century, who performed without a conductor) after the collapse took part in the formation of the State Orchestra.
That's how GASO would have gathered and played his anniversary concert without a conductor — it's a big deal! But it would be an act, a bright page in history, they would say, "our value is sovereign, we sit down and play," but... it's weak for them.
— Can I clarify: do I need to regularly invite figures like Zubin Mehta or Kurt Mazur to the console?
— The most famous does not mean the best. But in general you are right. Another thing is that the orchestra itself must be ready for such maestros.
— Is it necessary for European musicians to sit in our orchestras?
— Alas, our legislation does not allow it. Although for some reason it allows you to buy football players from Cameroon and give them Russian passports (this is the question of state priorities). But to announce a competition for the position of concertmaster, to call a musician – okay from Europe, from Ukraine! — It's impossible.
We tried to announce an international competition for the first harp in the Bolshoi Theater Orchestra, well, there were no worthy first harps in Russia. They immediately started calling us from the human resources department and telling us not to do this: "we don't want to spend days in the migration service!".
It seems that there is no "iron curtain", but it remains in the laws and in the minds of officials. But it's very useful to invite Western musicians — you have to feel the competition somehow!
— Maybe even appoint a foreigner to GASO?
— Again, when everything is fine in the orchestra, why not? Otherwise, he just won't understand which coordinate system he got into. How can I explain to him that I have to pay almost 1 million rubles to play in the Great Hall of the Conservatory?
— And if we aim to build a new hall for GASO?
— I will get an answer to this: "You know, Alexander Alexandrovich, historically GASO has never had its own hall. Well, why should it arise now?" That's all.
Another aspect is that the State Register must be recorded, leaving a trace behind. Let's say a cycle of Tchaikovsky's symphonies, a kind of new reading of Russian classics.
What else is good to do: build relationships with universities so that there is an influx of the right staff. Initiate the study of such specific instruments as the piccolo flute, the English horn, otherwise the musicians themselves begin to retrain…
I would also love to choose some orchestra on the periphery as a partner. I would take creative patronage over him, develop him. After all, it is wrong that everything closes only on Moscow. The musicians would go to master classes, play something together, we need to give an impulse!
Otherwise, there is nothing there — there was one cello in the Syktyvkar theater – musicians do not go to the hinterland, and if they go, the maximum is for an apartment, but where can I get so many of them?…
— How to build relationships with living composers?
— In Western orchestras, you have to play a certain number of modern music, and it doesn't matter whether people go to concerts or not. As long as the Union of Composers is alive, it is necessary to involve it in these processes.
Why don't many people play new music here? Because you have to buy a hall for a lot of money (the same BZK – 900,000 rubles per evening), and you will no longer be up to modern music – you are being pushed all the time to Rachmaninov's Second Concert. Simplification of practice.
— And as for the term of government of the State Register – for how many years is it optimal to invite the artistic director?
— The rule should be some kind of reasonable rotation. The period that was at the controls, for example, Evgeny Fedorovich Svetlanov, is considerable. Well, it was in a completely different country. Now all creative cycles have been shortened.
This is how I see it: one conductor can give the orchestra one thing, another another, and the orchestra grows on these conductors. And if the conductor overstays, all development stops.
— Is it necessary to cultivate second conductors, assistants from the youth?
— Who is the conductor? This is a man who knows: No matter what happens, I'm not going to be lost anyway. And that's right. The conductor must be independent. And if it is "nurtured", it turns out to be complete nonsense. You have to find your own way to get into this market, gain a foothold in it.
— So you reject the institution of second conductors?
— If you conduct everything all year round by yourself, of course, you need a second conductor. And if you have all the work, sorry, done, if Kurt Mazur stands at your desk tomorrow, and Seiji Ozawa the day after tomorrow, then you don't need a second conductor, but an assistant. That's the difference.
— Can the head of the State Registry have a job on the side?
— I have to. If the artistic director of GASO plays only in GASO, then this is the wrong chief conductor. And in this situation, I wonder how the Ministry of Culture will behave, because they want a decent artistic director, and where to get someone who is not burdened with plans for the next 3 years?
— What kind of employment do you have in Odense?
— 6 weeks a year. You understand that the main one should not get up at the console every day — it is important to organize the process so that the musicians themselves raise the level of the orchestra. This is ideal. The process of making the orchestra look divine takes 3–3.5 years.
When I came to the Bolshoi Theater, I fought–fought with the orchestra with all my might — and no result. But suddenly, at some point, there was a qualitative leap. Of course, you can sit down, thoroughly learn a specific program and play it well. But it's wrong to do that. It is necessary that the orchestra — regardless of who stands in front of them — show the level. It must be in the blood, at the level of habit.
— Can you teach this?
— Sometimes it is possible, and sometimes it is necessary to dismiss. It is wrong when the main one yells: "but you have something fake!", these issues should be resolved within the team, at the level of instrument groups. The better the orchestra, the more technical issues are NOT solved at the level of the chief conductor. And the artistic director deals exclusively with artistic tasks.
The questions — "higher tone — lower", "playing together — not together" — should go to the level of the concertmasters of the groups. That's how they should be organized. This is a correction of the head device.
A person should understand that you can not wear red socks to a dress pair.
So in the orchestra, the musicians THEMSELVES should not pass by the rehearsal falsehood. Then it will be interesting for major Western maestros with such an orchestra — they will communicate on equal terms, and not that the musicians will sit intimidated, hammered to the brim with endless drill…
— You said 3.5 years... that is, you can't take the main one for a shorter period?
— You can take three when everything is in order. When the machine is running. She drives by herself, without the fashionable "manual control". And not like we constantly have to find an "anti-crisis manager".
Source.
Jan SMIRNITSKY,
Moskovsky Komsomolets. October 9th, 2011
Moskovsky Komsomolets. October 9th, 2011
Alexander Vedernikov: "The artistic director of the State Orchestra must have a job on the side!"
